My response to @bitcoinflood - Do delegations Undermine The Entire POB Concept
Good morning to one and all , I hope you all are having a good day .
I just woke up today and hopped on Hive ( as I always do :) ) and saw my name tagged in one of the comments . It was a post made by @bitcoinflood .
The post is titled - Do Delegations Undermine The Entire POB Concept
I feel like I have an obligation to respond to this post . Why?
What's the need for the response ?
As many of you might already know , I run an engagement project on Hive for the following tribes -
- LEO
- STEM
- SPORTS
- POB
- WEED
- CTP
Since POB is one of the tribe and my @amr008.pob has received delegations from various users , I think it's necessary for me to respond to this post .
If you check the richlist of POB
The curation account is at 6th position right now .
With such big holdings ( atleast for now ) , I will explain why @bitcoinflood points doesn't fully apply to my curation account .
What does @bitcoinflood post say ?
If you haven't looked at the post I suggest you to do it because it is a wonderful post .
I would like to mention before hand that I agree with most of the points mentioned there but I just think it doesn't apply to my curation account .
Before going ahead , I would like to say in simple words how my project works
How to participate ?
You don't have to register or anything . All you have to do is comment from these frontends
https://ctptalk.com - to get CTP upvotes
https://sportstalksocial.com - to get SPORTS upvotes
https://leofinance.io - to get LEO upvotes
https://stemgeeks.net - to get STEM upvotes
https://weedcash.network - to get WEED upvotes
https://proofofbrain.io - to get POB upvotes
Remember that you have to comment from these frontends itself , why? to increase the traffic for the site and improve the rankings of the site . ( Believe me , it works , look at SportsTalkSocial alexa rankings ) .
But will everyone get upvoted ?
No , only the top 25 engagers will get upvotes , they will be ranked everyday based on quality of comments , number of authors they have spoken to etc .
The ranks are uploaded along with the data on https://hivelayers-stats.herokuapp.com everyday . Just go to community page ( choose this in left top ) .
Snippets and my response -
Instead of 1,000 people going around and curating content to get rewards 1,000 accounts now throw their powered up hive or tokens to a curation account. That one account now has to try and do the work of hundreds of people in terms of curating content each day.
I totally agree with this . No 1 person can do a job as effectively as 100 or 1000 people .
But with my project , it is not "me" who is curating but it is the bot which is curating .
A bot cannot replace 100 people too
I totally agree with this , it can't but if you have followed me and my project you will know how much improvements in the coding I have done to make sure only quality comments are upvoted .
Couple of examples of code improvements - https://leofinance.io/@amr008/ways-of-income-for-engagement-project-major-code-update-with-explanation-to-check-the-comment-quality
The negatives =
Passive income for those lazy
Centralization
Less activity and engagement
Passive income for those lazy
- This isn't totally negative according to me . A lot of users want to be involved in a project from early on but they don't have enough time to curate themselves .We all know how many communities are on Hive and it is impossible to curate everything by yourself so if you invest in a project and want it to grow then delegation is a good option which is positive in my opinion .
Centralization
- I totally agree with this . If 100 users delegate to 1 user and the 1 user upvotes whomever he wants or whichever content he thinks is good then it is centralized .
- But this isn't the case with my project because
- I don't have control over whom the bot votes . You have made good quality comments ? You get upvoted . I have explained in detail how the ranking works and I also post the top 25 users everyday to make it transparent ( from @amr008.ctp account ) . Anybody can see their ranking and since I take a lot of factors into count , only quality comments gets upvoted .
- But this isn't the case with my project because
- I totally agree with this . If 100 users delegate to 1 user and the 1 user upvotes whomever he wants or whichever content he thinks is good then it is centralized .
Less activity and engagement
- This is something which doesn't apply to my project at all because my project tries to do the total opposite of this . I believe it has increased engagement on POB platform to be honest .
Final words .
What you shouldn't mistake after reading this post is -
- @bitcoinflood didn't even mention me or my project . He wasn't referring to me or any particular person . He was just referring to all delegated accounts in general .
- This is not a "revenge" post , oh listen to "my version " of the post - NO . This is a response to that post which is mandatory on my part since in terms of delegations I stand 2nd in the POB community .
- I want to repeat that I have nothing in my hands when it comes to upvoting for engagement project , if you post quality comments you get upvoted .
- I like @bitcoinflood posts and this post too makes a lot of sense , I agree with majority of the post except one thing - it doesn't apply to my engagement project because I have worked and put effort on it to make sure it doesn't become centralized :)
I am always open to suggestions / advices / criticism . Feel free to ask me questions regarding the engagement project if you have any , I will be more than happy to reply to that .
Regards,
MR.
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I guess it also matters who/what you delegate to. A delegation to a project that rewards engagement would probably be a good thing. A delegation to a bid-bot probably not so much.
There's always that argument about rent-seeking when it comes to stake earning a passive income. If capital is put to productive use then it could be a force for good.
I agree with you a 100% . I just want to make my project as transparent as possible and since the project has received high amount of delegations I thought it was necessary to make a post on this .
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You are doing great work because of that those who don't have any stake can go and engage with tribes and get rewarded for quality comments and their time spend another hand like me I don't have much time to curate so I simply delegated my power to you so you can spend it wisely & I hope you continue to do so
Will definitely continue @aiovo :) Thanks for all the support .
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I will continue too
Moreover, I think that a good portion of the people delegating, are people who do not have time to use their HP and curate!
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Totally , I agree with that . It becomes increasingly difficult to curate in each and every community so delegation makes a lot of sense.
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I can speak to that fact. I don't have the time. I've got a family, work, and school to manage. I don't want to spend countless hours curating to make my votes most effective. Also, I read through the posts for the pleasure, as well as, the scrutiny. I can't vote on all the posts because they either fall outside of my guidelines or I'm not too sure about the originality of their content.
However, I do know @amr008's work. In delegating to him, I know the content he curates has quality.
I am satisfied with the work you are doing, friend, I think it is excellent!
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Glad to hear that @clicmaster . Just trying to make everything as transparent as possible . Also I have been busy lately because of a new project at hand , will get back to you on discord about the question you asked , sorry for the delay.
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perfect friend greetings and success in what you propose I hope soon to see what you are up to and see if I can contribute something!
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This is a valuable conversation to have... and there is a delicate balance that can be met to optimize both user rewards AND engagement. The more I read about your curation initiative, @amr008, the closer I get to pulling the trigger. Any day now. ;)
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Yea his engagement project's curation rewards tend to be better than most of the other projects. The reason why? Because he includes post rewards he gets into the final counts. Even if @amr008 takes his part, the extra rewards for that tend to help boost the rewards. Of course the only exception would probably be STEM because he doesn't get author rewards on that side.
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Hehe I am very happy to hear that . If you have any questions regarding the project , feel free to ask me I will try my best to answer all your questions .
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According to @bitcoinflood just delegation is not the proof of your brain. One should contribute to prove that they have brain but even if it is true, one needs to have brain to even calculate the profits and hence delegation to the right project should also be considered as the proof of brain only.
Lol yeah that makes a lot of sense too .
But I get his point , I hope he comes across this post and provides his thoughts on this .
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@amr008 you have always been doing a wonderful job to ensure that good contents are upvoted by you and I say kudos to you for the job well done...keep doing the awesome job,do not get discouraged..
Thank you very much @informationvault .
Well when people like you stop by and encourage , there is no question of stopping :) Will keep on improving the project .
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I do agree your project doesn't fit all the criteria that bitcoinflood mentioned and I personally like it. Its one of the starting factors that got me into commenting more and now I am being compared to taskmaster4450 in terms of comments. I don't know if I will dial down on the comments but I still plan to engage on the chains.
As evident in the daily engagement posts, I can see that usually there is at least 25 people making at least one comment through the POB front-end. I try not to go there because LEO itself takes enough time and I like to go where there is less activity.
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Thanks Jfang , well since the account is 6th highest POB holder right now , it becomes my responsibility to make sure I convey my side .
I understand how tiring it becomes to engage on all platforms :) But still you are doing a great job .
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This is an excellent explanation of the merits of this project.
I love the idea that this encourages the users to engage more and not do some shitty comments but write quality comments which means you need to read the post and understand it.
I totally agree with you and I believe this is a very good project with right vision and intention 👍
Thanks harpreet , it becomes my duty to explain to other community members how it works so that they can see how it benefits the community as a whole .
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Imo, @bitcoinflood showed us the 2 sides of a coin i.e. how Delegations can be used in a democratic system like PoB? After reading his post one must ponder upon their habits on the chain and decide what kind of a culture we want to create & promote as a community.
While there are Cons of delegation, we can always choose not to take advantage of it if we really want this ecosystem to thrive.
His post indirectly asked us this question - What will you do with your delegation? Will you use it in a decentralized manner to work for the benefit of the platform? Or will you satisfy your greed?
And you have answered these questions very well @amr008. Choosing to be on the right side of things. I am sure with constant feedback and suggestions, the system you have created will become better & more decentralized as compared to what it is currently. It's the intention that matters and you have the code to show it. ;) Cheers bro!!! You are doing great work. Will be delegating some of my PoB to you as soon as I get my delegation back from Brofi. Don't want to miss those crazy APRs while feeling good about my stake being used to reward people who are adding value.
Totally agree with you . As I said , a lot of points mentioned in his posts makes total sense to me .
I keep on trying to improve the script ( code ) too :) Thank you for your opinion , makes me happy :) hehe
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Yeah, you have put a lot of time and effort into the rules that your bot has to follow to make sure it is as close to being organic as possible. I remember some of the updates that you recently made and the fact that it looks for smaller or similar comments. It seems very intuitive for a bot!
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Personally, I do not have a lot of time to curate. I try my best with the limited amount of time I currently have (I'm hoping this run could potentially free up some time for me). I have a great appreciation for a lot of curation projects that help reward those that are putting in effort on the platform. Without them (you), this ecosystem would not function.
I think delegation is going to be a fact of life with any PoS ecosystem.
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Very good points. I think delegation here on POB makes a lot of sense. I plan on delegating a lot of POB as soon as get over 10,000 or more.
what @bitcoinflood did was to readdress certain issues of importance based on his observations which is very good. @amr008 has demonstrated a high level of transparency and accountability in his curation over the months and i'm a witness to that. I definitely know that what @bitcoinflood meant is not in anyway, applied to him.
Seeing this a little late notis get backed up on here but I wanted to say THANK YOU!
I highly value the feedback and totally agree that the "issues" don't apply to most curation accounts. I love hot button topics like this so sensible conversations can happen and out of it we can see all viewpoints and make adjustments or even come up with new great ideas from it.
Also thank you for going into details about how your curation works and the project you have here appreciate that.
Actually I would like to thank you for starting this conversation . It helped me explain the project working to everyone :)
I am glad that you liked the feedback .
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